The first time Matthew Macfadyen sat down opposite Michael Shannon, he burst into tears.
This was on one of the final days of shooting for “Death by Lightning,” the Netflix limited series about the 1881 assassination of President James A. Garfield that premieres on Thursday. Garfield, who served only four months before he was shot, was a principled Republican and a Civil War veteran who advocated liberal reforms, particularly of the civil service.
The two actors, both 51, had already shot a couple of scenes together, one in which Charles Guiteau (Macfadyen), Garfield’s future assassin, accosts the soon-to-be president (Shannon) outside the electoral convention, the other in which Guiteau shoots him. (Garfield, who succumbed to his wounds two and half months later, might have survived the bullets; incompetent medical interventions were more likely the cause of death.) But a scene in the White House in which a delusional Guiteau receives an audience with the president was their first and only extended interaction.
“Help me to succeed like you did,” Guiteau, wet-eyed, begs the president. “Tell me how I can be great too.” Of course, Garfield can’t, which sets the tragedy in motion.
Over a late October lunch in the Tribeca neighborhood of Manhattan, Macfadyen explained that the scene, in which those tears were neither rehearsed nor expected, had been a cinch to play. Shannon, in the role, had felt that famous, that presidential. “It’s not a great leap of the imagination,” Macfadyen said. “It’s like, Oh, here I am in front of Elvis. People do that. People scream.”
Shannon, seated beside, him nodded into his salmon and they discussed the odd nature of celebrity. “Here’s my advice,” Shannon said. “Don’t do any part where they’re going to make a Funko doll out of you.” Shannon had already made that mistake, having played the Superman antagonist General Zod.
Neither Shannon, a two-time Oscar and one-time Emmy nominee, nor Macfadyen, a two-time Emmy winner for his role as the sweaty striver Tom Wambsgans on “Succession,” are exactly superstars. But both are consistently thrilling screen presences. (They worked briefly on one other shared project, the 2019 thriller “The Current War.”)
Rivals no longer, they shared Macfadyen’s French fries as they discussed presidential politics, period facial hair and why a show set more than 140 years ago feels dangerously modern. These are edited excerpts from the conversation.
What drew you to the show?
MICHAEL SHANNON Well, it wasn’t like: “I heard you’re making a show about President Garfield. I’ve got to be a part of it!” But they said, “We want you to play the president.” Most of the time, people want me to play the assassin. I was very relieved when they said, “No, not the assassin.”
You have the bone structure of a bad guy.
SHANNON The beard covers up the bone structure. And it seemed like a beautiful way to use artistic expression to say a bunch of stuff that I’d like to say anyway: that the President is a public servant, not a king, and it’s their job to improve the lives and the well-being of the citizens.
What appealed to you, Matthew?
MATTHEW MACFADYEN I thought, What a journey to go on! And it felt very modern; it didn’t feel like a period piece. And it’s very sympathetic.
Why tell this story now?
SHANNON It just keeps getting more urgent. You throw in the blindness of the medical establishment back then, their refusal to actually believe that germs existed. And now you look at the tailspin that the medical industry is being thrown into by the current health secretary, who’s saying all kinds of insane garbage. Our little television program just keeps getting more relevant as time goes by.
Who is James Garfield?
SHANNON Well, I never got to meet the guy, so I’m only reading scholarship, letters between him and his wife, speeches he gave. But I buy what he’s selling. I’m not saying he’s a faultless human being. He admits to making mistakes, but he seems like a person who’s sincerely interested in furthering the United States of America to the extent that it’s an experiment that constantly needs to be nurtured and never taken for granted. He just seems like a really hardworking, earnest, compassionate, curious human being.
Who is Charles as you understand him, Matthew?
MACFADYEN He had a terrible upbringing. He was directionless. He wasn’t naturally good at the things he put his hand to. He wasn’t psychologically very well, but he wasn’t without ambition or passion. He stumbles onto Garfield by chance, has this lightbulb moment with him, shakes his hand. From then on, he really tries to help and be of service.
Did you grow the beards yourselves?
MACFADYEN I grew like 80 percent.
SHANNON Mine you could get at the Halloween store. I literally couldn’t grow that. It would never happen.
There are endless shows about murder, but assassination is a very particular flavor of murder.
SHANNON The ramifications of assassination are huge. This assassination changed the substance and character of the United States of America. Had Garfield been able to serve out his term or had a second term, we could be living in an entirely different present. Based on what he started, what his vision was, his dream for the country, perhaps it would be less divided.
You were in the middle of shooting when there was an assassination attempt against then-candidate Donald Trump. Did that change anything?
SHANNON It was like, Well, I guess we’re doing the right thing here in making this show.
MACFADYEN Yes, it’s not a lesson, a kind of museum thing that we’re getting out.
SHANNON This nation, as a nation, is not mentally well. The United States of America needs therapy, needs someone to talk to, perhaps even some medicine. This show illuminates that and recent events illuminate that in the equal measure.
The show keeps you apart for most of the episodes. What was it like to finally sit down together?
MACFADYEN Wonderful, tantalizing and frustrating. It was just a joy to play because everything built up to that point. For Charles, it was like meeting his absolute hero. It was a delicious thing to play as an actor.
Michael, do you think you would make a good president?
SHANNON I don’t think I’m qualified. I don’t think a lot of people are qualified. I don’t think the person currently doing it is qualified. Garfield was qualified. If you could somehow reanimate James Garfield in a not creepy way, that’s who I would want to be president.
Garfield seems so noble. How do you make that nobility interesting onscreen?
SHANNON Just stay focused on the task. A lot of what’s most interesting about Garfield is watching him navigate in this whole pool of barracudas. The nobility is a byproduct of the action. It’s an afterthought. A lot of times, Garfield finds himself in very difficult, awkward situations where he’s not entirely sure how to deal with what he’s having to deal with. Most people want things to be different, but they don’t have hope that they can be. Garfield is an example of someone saying, “I know there’s an insurmountable obstacle in my way, but I’m still going to attempt to rectify this situation.” That’s inspiring and thrilling.
At one point Charles joins a free-love commune in upstate New York. Matthew, would you do well in one?
MACFADYEN No, I’m much too British. I can’t have sex in public, out in the field.
SHANNON I didn’t always feel this way, but now that I’m in my dotage, the best version of that is with an individual.
What should we take away from this, other than a strong reminder to sanitize medical instruments?
MACFADYEN Aspire to be somebody like Garfield.
SHANNON There’s no situation that can’t be helped with a little more compassion and empathy.
Alexis Soloski has written for The Times since 2006. As a culture reporter, she covers television, theater, movies, podcasts and new media.
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