This is a lightly edited transcript of the October 17 edition of Right Now With Perry Bacon. You can watch the video here or by following this show on YouTube or Substack.
Perry Bacon: I’m honored to be joined today by Delia Ramirez. She’s a Congresswoman from the great state of Illinois and from the great city of Chicago—which is really, really great this time of year, particularly. And so I want to talk to her about two things. So what’s going on in Chicago right now, which I think is a big, important national story that’s happening locally, but also important nationally. And then also, the things happening in Washington, in terms of the government shutdown. So, Congresswoman, welcome.
Congresswoman Delia Ramirez: Hey, Perry, thanks for having me.
Bacon: Let me start with Chicago. So I think people know that there are ICE raids happening. And the governor has opposed the deployment of the National Guard, that has come anyway. So talk about what the situation back home is right now.
Ramirez: What you see is, you have an unaccountable, unconstitutional rogue agency who is violating constitutional rights every single day throughout the city of Chicago and Northwestern suburbs—and Southwestern suburbs, too, but really all over the Chicago area, because they think they can. They have been emboldened by this administration—by Kristi Noem, by Tom Homan, by the assistant director and the field director—to do whatever they want, to stop people, based on the color of their skin. And in many cases, to drag out of their cars women, mothers, citizens, and detain them.
Some would argue that, in many ways, it feels like the city is under siege—under an invasion of a federal government that’s been weaponized against the people. But, Perry, I also want to say that, while I’m saying all that and people are getting a visual what it feels like every day in Chicago, the community is fighting back. And they’re also fighting back in the courts. And today, we’ve had some major victories in the courts, that I’m grateful for.
Bacon: Talking about the court victories.
Ramirez: Yeah. So one of those that I want to mention to you is that the judge just ordered the ICE field director, Director Hott, who some of us, including Senators Durbin and Duckworth, have been demanding to meet with now for the last six weeks to testify before the court next week about the midway blitz operations, and what they’re doing across the city of Chicago. So I think that’s really important for the courts to say, you may not want to respond to Congress. You may think that you’re unaccountable. But you need to come before the court as a witness and talk about what we’re seeing in the streets of Chicago—certainly in Broadview, and around the state of Illinois.
But the second piece of that is that they’re saying that agents, all ICE agents, have to wear body cameras.
Bacon: Hm.
Ramirez: Part of why that’s so important for us, especially in this moment, Perry, is because ICE is reporting on what they’re doing, and what we see in footage, it doesn’t coincide. It is night and day from what they say is happening, and they’re making everyone less safe. For the courts to come back and say, every agent needs a body camera, it’s a level of transparency and accountability that we just have not seen in Chicago.
Bacon: So Broadview is—is—where is this? In the suburbs, right? And this is—and this is an ICE facility, and this is where there have been some protests. And now, to some extent, they’re sort of cracking down on the protesters there, particularly. Right?
Ramirez: That’s right. So Broadview is a holding center. Just for folks to know this: The state of Illinois, we do not have private detention centers. And so the federal government has these processing centers. It’s supposed to be a place for check-in, and a quick check—processing of a couple hours. No one should actually be there.
For weeks and weeks since June, Perry, Congressman Garcia, myself, Congressman Davis and Jackson, have attempted to do oversight of this building, and we’ve been denied. We’ve been told to send an email. When we send the email, when we made the calls, they finally gave us a date, and then they canceled it.
Bacon: OK.
Ramirez: And part of the questions, Perry, is what the heck is happening at Broadview? Why are they boarding up the windows so that we can’t see what’s happening in there? How many people are staying there? What kind of conditions are they in? Because what we’ve heard from people who’ve been contracted to clean there is it is inhumane conditions with worm in food—like, worms in the food. Absolutely inhumane.
And so part of what you’re seeing, this protest at Broadview, is people saying, we need accountability, we need transparency. We need to know what’s happening and why you’re taking people there. And what they’re doing is finding—confronting—priests, pastors and journalists with tear-gassing and beatings.
Bacon: Where is the National Guard? There’s not that many people, I assume, so it’s like a fairly small number. But where are they, and how are they playing into this?
Ramirez: Yeah, so let me also say to you that the courts have ruled, as well, that deploying the National Guard to Illinois, the Texas National Guard to Illinois, is unconstitutional. So where they should be is back in Texas. That’s where they should be.
Bacon: Right.
Ramirez: There’s a number of them that are in a Naval Academy that’s south of the city of Chicago. We have not seen them on the ground directly as much. We’ve seen a little bit of activity south of the city.
But frankly, here’s the point, Perry. You have a president and a secretary and a border czar who don’t respect rule of law. The courts have clearly indicated it’s unconstitutional to have the National Guard, it’s unconstitutional not to wear body cameras, it’s unconstitutional to stop people based on physical appearance and without a warrant, and yet, they’re still doing it. And so that’s why the stuff that is happening on the ground, the rapid responders, the neighbors, people who are recording what they see, asking for warrants is so important. Because it’s footage that then is used in the courts to prove and provide evidence that they’re violating the law every single day.
Bacon: So are they throughout—is ICE throughout the city, or is there certain areas they’re concentrating in? And it is a … does everyone know they’re there—
Ramirez: No.
Bacon: —or are there certain areas that are heavily—
Ramirez: No.
Bacon: Latino, to put it bluntly? Or where—where—
Ramirez: Strategically, what they have been doing is really targeting particular districts. I would say to you that if you lived in my district, in the parts of the district that I represent, that I live in, some of us would argue we see Black Hawk helicopters every single day, and it feels like they’re targeting us only. But the reality is that Congressman Garcia’s district, myself, Congressman Danny Davis’s district, now you’re seeing it in Congresswoman Robin Kelly’s district in the Southeastern part of the city. They’re seeing this activity. The suburbs are also seeing it.
They’re taking advantage of communities that may not have the level of infrastructure, of support that perhaps we have in Chicago—like Elgin or Waukegan or Joliet or Aurora. And they’re also targeting people. But really, if you ask me, wherever they see immigrant populations, or immigrant communities working, they’re attempting to target.
But Perry, here’s the other part that just seems crazy to me. So much of this seems crazy to me. They’re also going down Michigan Avenue. I mean, you saw agents—
Bacon: Hm, yeah.
Ramirez: —a couple weeks ago in one of the busiest, most touristic parts of the city where people go shopping, and the most highest name brand stores, coming with force. They weren’t even really doing that much enforcement. But to be able to demonstrate that they’re militarizing our city, and for the people coming into the city to see that we’re under siege. It’s all intentional, designed to attempt to weaken dissent and democracy in the city of Chicago.
Bacon: So what are people doing about it? You know, I like what the governor is saying. He’s been strong, I think, in my mind. What the governor’s doing, he’s been forceful, in my view.
Ramirez: Yes, I think the governor is doing an exceptional job. I think the mayor is doing an exceptional job. Just last week, I did a press conference with the mayor right in front of my school—one of my schools, my neighborhood school, actually, from—from where I live. And we talked about these ICE-free zones, which basically what it states is that the mayor has passed an executive order that indicates that ICE and the federal government cannot stage ICE raids in public Chicago property, right?
Bacon: Hm.
Ramirez: So if it’s a parking lot, if it’s a particular street, or a school, or a hospital, they are not allowed to stage in these areas. And furthermore, they’re really working with a lot of the businesses to remind them of this, Perry, that I think some people just don’t know. I’ll certainly tell you, I’m working with companies like Home Depot so that they can know their rights. But basically that if you’re a business, you’re a private entity, you could deny service, technically, to anyone. We know this.
So working with Chambers of Commerce, and working with small businesses, and other businesses, and retail, and restaurants, we’re saying to them, you could put up a sign—and the city of Chicago has provided some of this information for these businesses that say, “ICE is not allowed in this property. You must have a warrant to enter my private entity.” And that’s important, because that’s protection of your customers—whether it’s Menards, Home Depot, or a restaurant, and also your employees.
I mean, just think about it. You’re walking around at Home Depot, trying to purchase, you know, I don’t know, supply for a development project. And all of a sudden, ICE is just roaming through those aisles, threatening and arresting people, or arresting your employees. No one is safe when the business is not also enforcing their protections and their rights as a private entity.
So one of the things that we’re doing is making sure that small businesses, and businesses alike, know that they are a private entity, and they can prevent them from coming, and always require a warrant. The other thing I would say to you is that there’s a lot of people who are monitoring ICE activity throughout the city and state, and they’re recording. Because the point is this, Perry: They think that if no one is looking, they can do whatever they like.
They killed Silverio Villegas-González in Franklin Park, right by the airport, and then tried to turn it around and make it about him, that he was the aggressor. When you saw footage from the businesses and from the people who filmed, it contradicted everything ICE said about that incident. ICE killed this man, a father with full custody of two children, after dropping off his children to daycare.
And so what the things that people are doing is making sure that they have full cam—like, their battery packs are full, and they’re recording what they see. They’re reporting ICE activity to the hotline. And if someone is taken, sometimes citizens who are being taken, connecting them to legal services or to our office to monitor and identify who has been taken, and what the status and where they’ve been taken is.
Bacon: So part of the story you’re telling me is that people in Chicago are standing up to this?
Ramirez: Absolutely. People are organizing. We’re talking about hundreds of people, Perry. I have people in my district who said to me just last week, and one in front of a school, Congresswoman, I’ve lived in this neighborhood for a couple of years. I’ve never really been involved, but I heard that they were tear-gassing people right in front of the school playlot.
And so I came out, I took three hours of my day. And I’m here, standing here, making sure that my neighbors know that I will protect them. I will do everything I can, whether it is buying diapers for a family who—whose parents was taken, or they can’t afford to buy groceries or diapers because they’re afraid of going to work. Or if it’s me showing up at the school and providing safe passages.
You have neighbors who are saying we will become human buses. Parents are afraid of dropping off their child, because in front of their child or with their child, they’re taking them. We will go ahead and make sure kids are able to safely go and come back from school.
So these are everyday neighbors organizing, mobilizing, becoming part of the rapid response team, taking on shifts throughout the day. And to me, that’s the most inspiring part of all this, because they’re also the ones that are asking local elected, state electeds, and members of Congress, what are you doing? File more legislation. Do everything you can to protect the sovereignty of the state of Illinois. Do everything you can to protect the sovereignty of Chicago.
And also, how about legislation to ensure that these rogue ICE agents don’t continue to recklessly drive through our communities, causing accidents and killing people? Oh, another idea. Let’s file legislation to be able to ensure that ICE agents can’t recklessly drive. So much of these ideas of legislative action are coming from the people on the ground watching what’s happening.
Bacon: Are there going to be protests there Saturday? Are you going to be involved?
Ramirez: I am. Look, this president is attempting to silence us all. That is what authoritarian agendas are about, making sure that everyday people no longer feel safe and free to dissent, to express their freedom of speech.
But it is our responsibility to protect our First right Amendment, our freedom of speech, and the Constitution and democracy. I will absolutely be out there. I will be at a couple of rallies throughout the city of Chicago, and the Chicago area. And I really encourage people—show up, have your cameras, bring more people. And even more importantly, after you leave the rally, leave with five things that you will do to take action to be able to stand up against the fascism and the wannabe King and dictators that we see here in D.C.
Bacon: What should those of us who don’t live in Chicago, anything we can do?
Ramirez: Look, I think that you need to continue to talk about what’s happening in Chicago, Perry. Because here’s what’s happening. This president wants to test Chicago and make Chicago ground zero to test how far they could go, how much they can get away with, and what level of pushback there will be, and when it’s successful.
So people have to understand, it may not be happening in your city right now. They are attempting to break us in Chicago so that they can go to your city next. Talk about Chicago. Talk about the fact that what’s the biggest concern of safety in this precise moment in the city of Chicago is called I-C-E, Immigration Customs Enforcement, and that people need to continue to speak out. People need to talk about the impact on businesses, and children, and seniors, and on citizens.
Because frankly, Perry, no one is safe under this government right now. 170 United States citizens have already been taken, dragged, and kept in correction facilities and detention centers for days already. It doesn’t matter if you have status or not.
And the other piece that I think is important for people to understand, that they are not just raiding Latino communities, or immigrant communities. They’re going into Black neighborhoods, too, zip-tying children in Black neighborhoods. It is important for us to understand that this is a time of solidarity, of a multicultural coalition that’s coming together and speaking up and saying, not in my name. I will not allow you to continue to violate rights.
So keep talking about Chicago. I think that we should continue to talk about the importance of litigation, and the courts, and filing these lawsuits. These individual ICE agents think they can do whatever they like, and there’s immunity. And we should start talking about lawsuits for the individual, as well.
Bacon: This is my view: I would like to see your colleagues in Washington do a little more speaking about what’s happening in cities. And healthcare is important, but other things are important, too.
Ramirez: And they’re interconnected.
Bacon: Do you agree that they could do more?
Ramirez: Yeah. I mean, look, I said to our leadership this week, we should be talking about the government shutdown. We should be talking about expanding health care. You know, I talk about this every single day.
And, we can’t ignore the fact that cities like Chicago, like Oregon, like L.A., are living in day-to-day fear from its own government. We need to talk about what’s happening in Chicago, and how it’s interconnected with this government shutdown. They’re not separate issues, they’re all interconnected.
But here’s the problem. I think sometimes we think, oh, it’s just too much messaging, or people are not going to get it. People are under attack. Whether it’s your healthcare, or whether it’s ICE attempting to arrest you, detain you, kidnap you, or send you to Sudan. Like, this is happening every day, and it’s all interconnected by an authoritarian government that sees us as a threat to their fascism.
So, no, I think we need to do more. I’m going to continue to ask for everyone to talk about what’s happening in Chicago. Because, also, the resilience of Chicago should be inspiration for the rest of this country.
Bacon: Talk about the shutdown a little bit itself. So we’re in week three, I think. What is—so this position, I guess, I read somewhere Senator Shaheen wants to have some kind of agreement where the government opens, and that in exchange for that, the Republicans vote for—Democrats vote to open the government. Republicans, in exchange, agree to a vote for one year of Obamacare subsidies. What do you think about that?
Ramirez: Look, I think we are anxious for the government to reopen. And the government should reopen, making sure that healthcare is protected. I think it’s all in the same sentence.
And I think that the longer we go, the more that people understand what’s at stake. That there’s no clean C.R. that the Republicans are trying to pass. They’re trying to pass a continuing resolution that would gut your healthcare system—a system that we actually know should be improved, not gutted, right?
Bacon: Right.
Ramirez: And so I think that as the weeks go by, we are seeing all sorts of challenges in our neighborhoods and our communities, federal workers not getting paid. But we are actually at risk of benefits being cut at the beginning of November. It’s why I think it’s important that all of us should be asking ourselves: Where the heck are Republicans right now? Are they out on vacation? Are they out, God knows where, doing whatever they are doing?
Because they’re not at town halls. They’re not showing up to their office. They’re not showing up and talking to their constituents. Everyone should be demanding that every member of Congress is in Washington, D.C., doing everything they have to do to reopen the government and to protect healthcare.
But the other part of that, too, and Perry, maybe some people don’t want me to say this part. We should also be, in whatever legislation we pass, talking about accountability and congressional oversight to what’s happening in agencies across the country, because there has to be guardrails. And the point is, Democrats can’t look to the side as they continue to violate your constitutional rights, because there’s no guardrails. That needs to be part of the conversation, as well.
Bacon: What do you say? What do you mean when you say guardrails? What can—what can be in the bill? Do you mean specific—
Ramirez: Guardrails to protect us from rescissions from—from taking away funds that Congress had already authorized … Can you still see me?
Bacon: I can’t see you, but go ahead. I can hear you still.
Ramirez: OK, sorry. My phone keeps going off. So what I was saying is, we need to make sure that anything related to rescissions, anything related to accountability and oversight of how funds are used, the policies in which agencies operate, that needs to be part of the conversation, as well. Because what’s happening is that so many of these agencies and their agency heads who are put in by Donald Trump are trying to abuse congressional authority to get away with cutting critical programs and laying off critical staff that represent the American people every day, and the safety net services that they need.
Bacon: With that, anything else you want to say? I think you give us a lot to think about, and some very important notes about Chicago. Anything else you want to conclude on, or anything else you want to add?
Ramirez: Perry, here’s what I would say. I often get asked, what are you doing to protect me? I’m not offended by that.
You know, some people would say, well, you know, but aren’t you doing a, b, and c; you work 70, 80 hours a week. You’re on the line every single day. You’re providing constituency services. Yes, I am. And you should be asking what I’m doing.
This is a moment where elected officials need to be doing more, not less. Whether you’re a Republican or a Democrat, you should be able to talk about all the ways that you are showing up for your constituents every day. And it’s more than letters, Perry. It’s using every authority. We should stop just voting on some of these bills that come in on Monday’s suspension that do nothing to actually impact people.
Republicans have to understand that actually negotiating means that we don’t give you a red carpet. We demand to be in a room to negotiate every piece of legislation that we’re voting on. And that means that we have to do a better job in demonstrating that we’re the opposition party.
I think this is a moment where Americans are looking at us and asking, tell me all the ways that you are fighting back. And then tell me the other five ways that you’re going to fight back next week. We should be OK with that. And you should continue to ask of us that every single day.
Bacon: Great note to end on, Congresswoman. Thank you for all the work you’re doing. And thank you for joining me.
Ramirez: Thank you, Perry.
Bacon: Goodbye.
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