Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s appearance on Capitol Hill on Thursday quickly broke down into a series of angry denials, fractious name-calling, and even yelling.
The combative tone of the hearing was set from the start as the health and human services secretary’s testimony came with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in chaos, with its leadership ousted on top of mass firings.
At the same time, Kennedy has been widely accused of undermining science and the future of America’s vaccine policy.
Every single Democrat on the Senate Finance Committee, before which RFK Jr. testified, called for his resignation moments before the hearing got underway.
While much of Kennedy’s hostilities were directed at Democrats who did nothing to hide their disdain for the secretary, Kennedy also butted heads with Republicans who raised concerns about his anti-vaccine activities and repeated contradictions.
Throughout the hearing, the secretary repeatedly undermined data, rejected allegations, and dismissed decorum to spar with senators.
“We’re the sickest country in the world, that’s why we have to fire people at the CDC,” Kennedy angrily shouted in response to Chairman Mike Crapo early on. “They did not do their job. This was their job to keep us healthy.”
Kennedy went personal almost from the get-go. When Ranking Member Ron Wyden angrily accused him of putting kids in harm’s way by pushing out scientists and doctors and allowing conspiracy theories to dictate health policy, Kennedy was quick to fire back.
“Senator, you’ve sat in that chair for how long? 20-25 years while the chronic disease in our children went up to 76 percent, and you said nothing,” Kennedy said.
Wyden got the last word, noting Kennedy’s attack on the lawmakers despite them working on bipartisan legislation focused on chronic illness.
When it was Senator Michael Bennet’s turn, he questioned Kennedy’s firing of every member of the vaccine recommendation panel. He brought up the anti-vaccine statements of some of the members Kennedy had replaced them with.
Kennedy said he agreed that the mRNA vaccines cause serious harm, including death, among young people, which Bennet was quick to quip was not true. Their back and forth escalated to screaming, with Kennedy trying to turn the tables and ask questions of the senator rather than the other way around.
“What you said were lies,” Bennet slammed Kennedy.
Kennedy pushed back, asking the senator if he was saying the COVID vaccine had never been associated with myocarditis and pericarditis, which have been described as rare.
“I’m simply trying to say that the people that you have put on that panel after firing the entire –” Bennet started.
But Kennedy cut in that Bennet was “evading the question.”
“No, I’m asking the questions here, Mr. Kennedy,” Bennet screamed back as Kennedy tried to speak over him. “I’m asking the questions, Mr. Kennedy.”
“I’m asking the questions on behalf of parents and schools, and teachers all over the United States of America that deserve so much better than your leadership,” Bennet shouted.
The intense exchanges did not stop there. Senator Mark Warner and Kennedy swapped heated words when the lawmaker asked the secretary about COVID deaths, and Kennedy said he did not know how many had died or how many lives were saved by the COVID vaccine.
GOP Senator Bill Cassidy grilled Kennedy over Operation Warp Speed to develop the COVID vaccine, as well as his concern that the department was blocking access to vaccines.
Kennedy listened as the Republican senator spoke, but he could not help but make a dig at one point in response to Cassidy’s criticism.
“Is this a question, Senator Cassidy, or is this a speech that you don’t want me to answer?” Kennedy cut in. He went on to talk about the “genius” of Operation Warp Speed under Trump, despite also slamming the U.S. COVID response.
At another point, Kennedy told the senator and physician that he “has the facts wrong.”
When Cassidy said, “Effectively we’re denying people vaccine” and gave two examples due to HHS actions, Kennedy slipped in a last word, telling him, “you’re wrong.”
When Senator Maggie Hassan accused Kennedy of deciding to change the parameters for the COVID vaccine behind closed doors, Kennedy cut in and said she was “just making stuff up.” She was not the only one he accused over the course of the hearing of lying.
“You know, sometimes when you make an accusation, it’s kind of a confession, Mr. Kennedy,” Hassan pushed back.
“You’re just making things up. You’re making things up to scare people, and it’s a lie,” Kennedy said, turning red as he denied that some people can no longer get access to the COVID vaccine.
But the very next senator to speak, a Republican and doctor, also expressed concern with Kennedy.
“Secretary Kennedy, in your confirmation hearings, you promised to uphold the highest standards for vaccines. Since then, I’ve grown deeply concerned,” said Senator John Barrasso. “The public has seen measles outbreaks, leadership in the National Institute of Health questioning the use of mRNA vaccines, and the recently confirmed director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention was fired. Americans don’t know who to rely on.”
“If we’re going to make America healthy again, we can’t allow public health to be undermined,” Barrasso said, raising his voice.
Another strange turn came when Kennedy told Senator Elizabeth Warren he did not fire the CDC director because he asked her to preapprove vaccine recommendations.
According to him, she was lying. He said she was ousted because he asked Susan Monarez if she was a trustworthy person, and she said “no.” The Democratic senator was incredulous.
She wasn’t the only one. Republican Senator Thom Tillis raised skepticism over Kennedy’s claim after Monarez was ousted only 29 days on the job.
“I don’t see how you go over four weeks from ‘a public health expert with unimpeachable scientific credentials, a longtime champion of MAHA values, caring and compassionate and brilliant microbiologist,’” Tillis said, reading Kennedy’s own words on Monarez. “And four weeks later, fire her because at least the public report says that she refused to fire people that worked for her.
“I would suggest in the interview you ask them if they’re truthful rather than four weeks after we took the time in the U.S. Senate to confirm the person, just for the future nominee that we’re going to have to consider,” Tillis added.
Tillis observed that Kennedy’s own comments about scientists and vaccines from his past hearing appeared to contradict his latest remarks and actions.
Kennedy and other senators were constantly speaking over each other and exchanging heated words that escalated into yelling. Warner called Kennedy ignorant and said one response was absurd.
Kennedy at one point called Senator Ben Ray Lujan “ridiculous.”
Georgia Senator Raphael Warnock had some brutal final words to Kennedy during his time that summed up much of how Democrats were feeling.
“You are a hazard to the health of the American people. I think that you ought to resign, and if you don’t resign, the president of the United States, who put forward Operation Warp Speed, which worked, should fire you,” the senator concluded.
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