An Army veteran who was arrested after burning an American flag near the White House told Newsweek he would welcome taking the fight all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court.
Jan Robert Carey, who goes by Jay, said he burned the flag in Lafayette Square on Monday as a “direct challenge” to an executive order that President Donald Trump had signed hours earlier, directing the Justice Department to investigate and prosecute people for burning the American flag.
Though the order acknowledged the Supreme Court’s 1989 ruling that flag burning is protected under the First Amendment, it said there is room to prosecute if it “is likely to incite imminent lawless action” or amounts to “fighting words.”
Carey, 54, who received a Bronze Star during the Iraq War, had traveled to Washington from North Carolina for a veterans’ protest against the deployment of National Guard troops in the nation’s capital.
Then he saw the news about the executive order.
“Presidents don’t make law, and Congress will make no law that infringes upon our rights in accordance with the First Amendment,” Carey told Newsweek.
“I realized that I needed to, that day, go and burn a flag in front of the White House to have the biggest impact and send the message to the President that he’s not allowed to do that.”
He picked Lafayette Square, he said, because it was the closest he could get to the White House.
In videos posted on social media, Carey is seen telling bystanders that Trump’s executive order violates the First Amendment. “I served over 20 years in the United States Army,” he said. “I fought for every single one of your rights to express yourself in however you feel that you may want to express yourself.”
This is replacing a previous post: A Veteran was detained outside of the White House by Secret Service after burning an American flag. pic.twitter.com/kXL5gPc2aj
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A spokesperson for the Army confirmed to Newsweek that Carey served in the Army for more than 20 years, and was deployed to Kuwait, Bosnia, Iraq and Afghanistan before retiring as a Sergeant First Class. As well as a Bronze Star, he received numerous medals including two Meritorious Service Medals, eight Army Commendation Medals and six Army Achievement Medals.
Carey said after he burned the flag on Monday, he was initially detained by the Secret Service then transferred to the custody of U.S. Park Police, who processed and released him after about five hours in custody.
He is now awaiting a court summons in the mail after being charged with violating a law prohibiting the lighting of a fire in a federal park.
But Carey said he understands he is being investigated for further charges. He said he received a call from someone identifying themselves as a Secret Service agent inquiring about Monday’s incident, and his wife and son were left voicemails.
“We have voicemails from them saying that we’re looking into Jan Robert Carey, your father or your husband, whichever one they called, and would like to ask you some questions,” he said.
Newsweek has contacted the Secret Service for a response to Carey’s comments. A Secret Service spokesperson told Newsweek that the agency “detained an individual in Lafayette Park for igniting an object. The individual was subsequently turned over to U.S. Park Police as they have jurisdiction.”
Carey said he believes he is being targeted because his actions have surely riled the president. “It’s an ego thing for him,” he said. “I’m sure he’s pretty upset that somebody immediately burned a flag after he signed an executive order stating that it would never happen again.”
Newsweek has contacted the White House for comment via email.
While signing the executive order, Trump said those who burn the flag should be sentenced to a year in prison. “You burn a flag, you get one year in jail. You don’t get 10 years, you don’t get one month,” he said. “You get one year in jail, and it goes on your record, and you will see flag burning stopping immediately.”
Carey said that if he faces more serious charges, he will take his case as far as the nation’s highest court.
“I welcome it,” he said. “I went there with the intention of them trying to make like, trying to pin stuff on me that they couldn’t prove, that wasn’t justified,” he said. “And I’m looking forward to going to the Supreme Court if necessary to fight this and to once again, reaffirm that we are protected in burning the United States flag under the First Amendment.”
Though he acknowledged the court now has a 6-3 conservative majority, he said: “I do have faith that when it comes to the interpretation of the Constitution, that they would rule in my favor.”
Go Deeper: Q&A with Jay Carey
Can you tell me about your time in the Army?
I’m a retired, disabled combat vet. Served a little over 20 years in the U.S. Army, deployed to Operation Desert Storm. I was in Iraq and Afghanistan. I served all over the country. I was a tanker. Majority of the work I did in the Army, though, as far as during deployments for Iraq and Afghanistan were on the ground. I was a noncommissioned officer in charge of a military transition team. In Iraq, we directly trained an Iraq infantry battalion for operations. We were successful, highly successful. And that’s when I received my Bronze Star.
What made you decide to burn the flag on Monday? Why did you choose that spot?
I saw on some on social media feeds during lunch that Trump had signed an executive order outlawing the burning of the US flag, which is a direct violation of our First Amendment rights within the Constitution. He doesn’t have the right to do that. Presidents don’t make law, and Congress will make no law that infringes upon our rights in accordance with the First Amendment. So I realized that I needed to, that day, go and burn a flag in front of the White House to have the biggest impact and send the message to the President that he’s not allowed to do that. He will not infringe on our rights. I did it as a direct challenge to his executive order. The location was key. It was as close as I could get to the White House, and I was directly in front of it in Lafayette Park.
What happened afterward?
So the Secret Service police were the first ones on site, they took me into custody, handcuffing me, and then after a little bit, they moved me back to one of their vehicles within the secure area, right in front of the White House that’s behind gates or fencing, sat me in a vehicle. Then they had about an hour discussion with Park Police on who had jurisdiction. They argued over that, I guess, a little while, and they decided that Park Police had jurisdiction since I was in Lafayette Park. The Park Police transported me, they handed me over, transported me to their D block detention area for processing, where I was put in a single stand-alone, cell, and then I was processed, pictures, fingerprints, ran me through the system to ensure that I didn’t have any kind of outstanding warrants. I have a clean record. I’ve never been arrested. Took about five hours. Once they finished the processing and it came back clear, they gave me two citations, one for starting a fire without an approved container. The other for starting a fire in a national park in an undesignated area and causing damage to the national park, which there was no damage. I did it on bricks. They put me out the door, I’ve been to D.C before that, like three times. I don’t know the area. It was dark, it was late. It was like 10.30 at night, 11 o’clock, whatever it was, pointed me in the wrong direction, and sent me on my way to where I needed to go. So two hours later, I finally got back.
Do you have an upcoming court appearance? What’s happened since?
They’re going to be mailing me that information to my home. But one thing that I found out since the Secret Service have contacted my family, they’re investigating me, and my understanding is yesterday, the Department of Justice admitted that they are investigating me for further charges.
I was informed because they called me looking for my wife. They didn’t know who they were calling because apparently they’re not too swift. They asked me if I knew Jan Robert Carey. And I was like, ‘Yes, I do, I’m him.’ And then they hung up on me. So they called my wife, called my son, neither of them answered, let it go to voicemail. I had already talked to them about it and I told all my close friends and family that they might reach out to, just to warn them about it and how to react to it. You know, I’m securing a lawyer. I’m not going to appear in any court without legal defense, even just for the misdemeanors, because, you know, they have a way of turning, turning and twisting things right? And I’m very sure that the President is very upset. You know, it’s an ego thing for him. I’m sure he’s pretty upset that somebody immediately burned a flag after he signed an executive order stating that it would never happen again.
Can you tell me more about the communications you’ve received?
The Secret Service called on Tuesday. They identified, I don’t remember the name of the agent, but they identified themselves. Said they’d like to talk to Leslie Carey. I said, ‘well, Leslie Carey’s not here.’ ‘Well, can we talk to Christopher Carey?’ Christopher Carey is my oldest son. He’s 27. ‘Christopher Carey is not here.’ I said, ‘who is this? I mean, what do you want?’ ‘Well, we’d like to talk to them in conjunction with what happened yesterday with Jan Robert Carey. Do you know him?’ I was like, ‘I’m Jay Carey.’ They’re like, Oh, do you know Jan Robert Carey? I said, ‘yes, I’m him.’ ‘OK, have a good day.’ And they hung up.
They called my family. We have voicemails from them saying that we’re looking into Jan Robert Carey, your father or your husband, whichever one they called and would like to ask you some questions. They tried to question me that night, the Secret Service, and I refused to talk to them.
So you believe you are being targeted at the direction of President Donald Trump? What makes you think that?
Why do I think he is? Because I think he is an unstable narcissist who has targeted… he’s targeting people if they say he doesn’t look healthy. You know, he is such a reactionary. He has such a fragile ego. When he sat there and signed his, you know, did you see him signing the executive order for the flag burning? He was very confident that it would never happen again. This is his nature. This is his MO. When someone pushes back on him with anything, regardless of who they are, whether they’re a Republican, a Democrat, a citizen or an elected official, he immediately starts pushing back and trying to find something that he can do to them, to hurt them, whether it’s legally, whether he insults them, insults their family, insults their heritage. In the case of Governor Pritzker insults his body, body shamed him. He’s a child. The President is a child who doesn’t like his ego to be hurt, a spoiled child. And you know, with power now, with apparently unlimited power.
How do you feel about that?
I welcome it. I went there with the intention of them trying to make like, trying to pin stuff on me that they couldn’t prove, that wasn’t justified. And I’m looking forward to going to the Supreme Court if necessary to fight this and to once again, reaffirm that we are protected in burning the United States flag under the First Amendment, as we all know, was proven in 1989 the Supreme Court decision. I mean, our Supreme Court is not quite as balanced as it was then. So there is always a chance. You know, you’ve seen what they have, these things, they’ve actually ruled on. So there’s always a chance. But I do have faith that when it comes to the interpretation of the Constitution, that they would rule in my favor.
What’s next for you?
I’m here in Washington with a veterans’ group that me and four others had formed. We’re going to continue to protest the occupation of U.S. soil by U.S. troops at the behest of the president. And we’re going to stay here in Union Station and do walkabouts and just observe ICE operations, things like that in the D.C. area until those troops leave and no longer occupy any U.S. soil, not just D.C., but anywhere. We are rememberyouroath.org.
Do you have a message you’d like to share?
We encourage everybody, whether they’re military or they support the military or veterans to come out and join us, whether it’s one day, one week, 10 months, one year, we’re here. We’re going to be here and show our faces, and we’re going to make sure that the people here see us. We’re not going to convince the president to change his mind. Nobody can, but we want to instill in the people that they can come here peacefully protest, and we are going to make a difference. We’re gonna end the occupation of U.S. soil by U.S. military.
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