Brie Larson floats into The Bear season four wearing pastel and a passive-aggressive smile. She is Francie Fak, a character whose reputation precedes her: Her name is first mentioned back in season two’s explosive Christmas episode, “Fishes,” when Cousin Michelle (Sarah Paulson) asks the Fak brothers Neil (Matty Matheson) and Ted (Ricky Staffieri) why their sister isn’t at the party. They confirm that there’s bad blood between Francie and Abby Elliott’s Natalie “Sugar” Berzatto, sister of Jeremy Allen White’s Carmy.
Tensions are still at a boil in the recently-debuted fourth season. Natalie is torn between ignoring her frenemy, who’s listed in her phone as “Francine Bitchfuck Betrayer,” and texting her— to say either “I miss you” or “Please go fuck yourself.” She and Francie are finally reunited at the wedding of Tiff (Gillian Jacobs) and Frank (Josh Hartnett) in episode seven. “It was Abby’s idea that we would both be wearing these headbands and cupcake dresses, going at it,” Larson tells Vanity Fair. “There’s a lot to be said with clothes.” We learn, among other revelations, that Francie and Natalie once hooked up.
Series creator Christopher Storer texted Larson about joining The Bear in early 2024, a collaboration that came roughly 15 years after they first met on the set of an independent film. “We both joke that we were the first people to take a chance on each other,” the Oscar winner says. “I just always believed in his talent, and obviously he felt the same way about me. So it’s just been such a treat for both of us to watch each other.”
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But it was Apple TV+’s Lessons in Chemistry—another series about an emotionally complex character who finds their higher calling in the kitchen—that really led her to The Bear. “For some reason, every single award show had us seated next to each other,” she says. “I just became absorbed into their family because they like all the same things—a bit of fun and chaos and food and drink. So I was bantering with Matty at one late-night thing, and shortly after that, Chris texted me and was like, ‘Hey, we’re thinking about finally bringing Francie into this. I asked Matty who he would want, and he said he wants you. So do you want to do it?’ And I was like, ‘I don’t care what it is. You can have me say one line. I’m there for you, buddy.’”
The Bear gave Larson a chance to reclaim her comedy roots—and now, she’s thrilled to finally discuss her role for the first time: “I’ve been hanging onto this secret for a year. I’m so excited to talk about it.”
Vanity Fair: Guest stars on The Bear are top-secret. What was it like to keep this on the down low for so long?
Brie Larson: I’m pretty used to keeping secrets now because of the many years working with Marvel. But it doesn’t make it any easier. I needed to go to Chicago for a week, and I didn’t know how to explain to anybody why I was going to Chicago. So I just tried my best to avoid that question. If anybody was like, “Do you want to grab lunch?” “I’m in Chicago.” “Why?” “Seeing art.”
In terms of the episode, I had the script, so I knew basically all the beats of what it was going to be. But the thing that makes the show, I think, so charming and lovable and fun is how much improv there is. So there’s actually quite a few things of mine that are fully improvised. The scene with my two brothers where they’re saying that I’m never nice to their girlfriends—that was just one take, completely improvised. They really live by that “every second counts” mantra. They don’t waste any time, and they’re usually done around lunchtime every day. I watched the episode before we did this interview because I was like, “I wonder how much of [that scene] is even in.” It was all there.
What was it like to watch the episode for the first time?
Oh, it made me laugh and cry. That’s the beauty of the show: it really dives into the messy complication of loving and being a family, and trying to keep it together, and not being able to. That episode really exemplifies it. It’s just very funny and sweet at the same time, and I think it’s a real reflection of that group. I felt really lucky that I got to be there for a week and see how they do things. I felt incredibly inspired. Actors are coming to hang out on set when they’re not even filming, because everybody’s part of the process and has bought into what they’re making. I’ve never seen a set like that before. I want to shout from the rooftops that this is possible, and this is how we should be making everything.
What did it feel like to go from Lessons in Chemistry, where you’re in basically every scene and were also deeply involved as a producer, to popping in for an episode on someone else’s show?
Sometimes you want to be the one driving the car across the country, and sometimes you want to be the passenger. I really know the times when I want to drive. And being on that set, I felt like I got to have all the pleasure and joy of acting without needing to worry about any responsibility, which is really nice.
I also was given the permission to improvise, which is not something that I’ve done in a long time. I used to basically only do comedy films. Comedy was the only job I could get before Short Term 12. So there’s a lot of pleasure in being in a safe place where you’re just building a character and bantering and trying to make each other laugh. It’s such a different experience than doing a lot of what I normally do, which is pensive, dramatic. You just feel really good at the end of the day.
You have limited time and dialogue to convey a really loaded conflict between Francie and Sugar. How much did you and Abby Elliott talk about the backstory, and what exactly has transpired between them?
Here’s another funny story: we were at the SAG Awards at the same time. We knew that we were playing characters with longtime beef, but nobody else did. And we just kept making eyes at each other. And I was like, “I’m going to fuck you up.” And we just kind of started it there.
But we decided before our first big blow-up that we shouldn’t talk too much about it. What we discussed with Chris was that there is an inciting incident that pushed it all over the edge, but it’s sort of inconsequential. It’s more that these are two women who were best friends, grew up together since they were children, and both have a laundry list of things that they’re pissed about, and they’re willing to talk about it any possible moment they can.
So we didn’t need to be yelling about the same exact story. We were yelling about so many different things. And certain times, I would hear things she was saying, and I was like, “She’s talking about whipped cream? What is this whipped cream that we’ve decided is involved now?” I was talking about the rain and a bus, and that there were no cell phones, and abandoning her basically on some road trip. So it kind of was like a free-for-all with that part. Then once we got through that, it felt like we were able to be Brie and Abby and figure out what we wanted to actually say with it.
We also learn that Francine and Sugar share a bit of a romantic past. How do you think that comes to bear on their contentious dynamic?
I actually don’t really know. Who’s to say? I feel like the whole thing with them is that everything just got really close. I think that the messiness with it—somewhere between hooking up, but also being sisters. I’m sure it was one of those things where their clothes are all at each other’s houses, and they’re sharing. It’s that thing of like, “Oh, you didn’t even ask to borrow my lipstick, and you ruined it.” So them hooking up to me extends into every part of their relationship of them just being enmeshed in this way. I guess that’s for future episodes to explore.
What does Francie’s day-to-day look like?
I created this backstory that she was a micro-influencer, because I was constantly caring about my appearance and taking selfies. I see a version [of the show] where that part comes into play and is helpful in the future for the restaurant.
Do you foresee Francie coming back next season?
I had the absolute best time, would fly across the country and work with them for one hour if that’s what it took. I don’t know if anybody knows what the future holds, but I think it’s a really nice place that their relationship ends. Maybe men deal with this too, but I know as a woman, it’s such a relatable thing. When I finally saw the episode, I teared up a bit. I know what it’s like to have close girl friendships that go south, then you find a way to make peace. It’s just such a beautiful thing to grow in your life and to be able to accept an apology, or be the one to say an apology and put things in the past. But if there’s another season, I really want to be there.
Earlier this year, you made your West End debut in a production of Elektra. How did that experience change your outlook on what’s next as an actor?
I’ve come from the independent world, and then Marvel world. With independent film, you just don’t have enough time to rehearse. And then with Marvel, you’re just up against time, Or it’s so secretive you don’t know what it is that you’re even doing, so you have to learn how to figure it out on your own.
But with the play, I wanted to see what it was like to rehearse and do the same exact piece from beginning to end every day. Just even wondering if I could memorize the whole thing was really scary. But I like doing things to make me feel that nervous excitement where I don’t know what’s going to happen.
The other thing that I really loved about it is that everybody had to put their phones away. I’m so guilty of it too, of watching something and being on my phone. We love culture, watching life reflect back to us, but we’re missing it because we’re also scrolling on our phones. I love that with a play, whether it made sense to you or not, you had to sit there and stick with it. And if it didn’t make sense to you, you had to go to a pub and talk to a friend about it.
During that scene on The Bear where several people are crammed beneath a table, each character shares one of their fears. What is something you’re scared to do, but still excited to try someday?
I think maybe a musical. Having done a play that did have musical elements, I was like, “Dang, this is really hard.” So I have a lot of respect for people who do that. I love to dance. And then the other one that I’m avoiding is doing a French-speaking film. Because I can speak French, and I can speak French better than I admit—but I’m embarrassed, so I don’t use it very often. I’ve been trying to be more proactive about speaking in French, and maybe one day I will let other people see that.
This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.
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