Patricia Clarkson’s biggest career regret? Losing out on a role in ‘Big.’

By the mid-1990s, Patricia Clarkson’s career had reached new heights — literally.

“I got flown first class to Vancouver!” Clarkson, 65, recalled to Business Insider of shooting the 1995 fantasy adventure movie “Jumanji.” “Things were going well.”

A bigger paycheck for a small role in a blockbuster starring Robin Williams was Clarkson’s first real taste of being in the big leagues, something she’d dutifully worked towards since her breakout role as the wife of Kevin Costner’s character Eliot Ness in Brian De Palma‘s 1987 hit “The Untouchables.”

Life was good — until suddenly, it wasn’t. By 1997, the worked had dried up.

“I was starting to struggle,” Clarkson said. “That’s when ‘High Art’ came into my life and changed everything.”

The independent romantic drama, in which Clarkson played Greta, the German heroin-addicted girlfriend of photographer Lucy (Ally Sheedy), who’s entangled in a love affair, was the darling of the 1998 Sundance Film Festival. The role opened up the world of independent film to Clarkson, garnering her her first nomination for an Independent Spirit Award and paving the way for her to become a fixture in indie film for the rest of her career.

Since then, Clarkson has become one of the most dependable character actors on both the big and small screens. She won two Emmys playing Sarah O’Connor on the acclaimed HBO series “Six Feet Under,” earned an Oscar nomination for “Pieces of April,” and scared the hell out of audiences in Martin Scorsese’s “Shutter Island” (and the HBO miniseries “Sharp Objects”).

Now, she’s returning to her indie roots playing the eponymous lead in “Lilly,” a biopic on Lilly Ledbetter, whose landmark win against her employer, Goodyear Tire and Rubber Co., for gender pay discrimination was a major moment in the fight for fair and equal pay in America.

“What was important to me was to see this woman as just an ordinary mother and woman who kind of rises from the ashes,” Clarkson said of the role.

Thanks to independent film, Clarkson has done the same.

In our latest “Role Play” interview, Clarkson looks back on her big break, battling with Harvey Weinstein over her awards season run for “The Station Agent,” and her “spicy era” starring in romantic dramas.

On her career beginnings and how Brian DePalma got her paid extra on ‘The Untouchables’

Business Insider: Your first screen credit is quite impressive, playing Kevin Costner’s wife in Brian De Palma’s “The Untouchables.” Tell me about that audition process. 

Patricia Clarkson: I was out of Yale several months, and I had just gotten my first Broadway job, “House of Blue Leaves,” and then I go in to read for “The Untouchables” with the legendary casting director Lynn Stalmaster.

I went in kind of dressed as Southern glamorous. I had my hair done, makeup, pretty sexy dress. Lynn said to me he thought Brian De Palma would like me, but he said, “Don’t look like this. Put on a simple dress and no makeup.” I was like, No makeup? So I did. I had very long hair at the time and had this dress that tied in the back, and maybe a touch of lipstick. I came in and I was supposed to do my lines with a reader, but Brian said, “I’m going to read with you.” He liked the juxtaposition of me in this “Little House on the Prairie” dress and my deep voice. We started talking, and I made him laugh, and he was just lovely to me. So I went right to Chicago and met Kevin Costner because he was already there preparing, and I got the job. 

And then right when you thought you were done with the job, Brian surprised you with something. 

Yes! This was a very supporting part, so I was set to be done, and Brian decided that I had to be in the courtroom scene. He wanted to have one close-up of me in the courtroom. So he told Paramount, “Look, I guess we’ll have to hold Patti for a month because we’re not shooting the courtroom for another month.” And it was a godsend.

I was making scale, I was an unknown, but that extra month helped me out. I mean, I had student loans to pay, I was living in New York. Despite it being scale, which back then was maybe $1,000, it was more money than I had. It was a saving grace, and it was all because of Brian De Palma. 

On her path to indie film and sparring with Harvey Weinstein

After “High Art,” you had become something of an indie darling: “Pieces of April,” “The Station Agent,” and “All the Real Girls” all had their world premieres at the 2003 Sundance Film Festival. But during the filming of any of that, did you ever question your choices, say, sitting in a station wagon all day making “Pieces of April” or hanging out by a train station doing “The Station Agent”? 

No. These were gifts. They were remarkable films, and I knew it. I didn’t know Tom McCarthy, who made “The Station Agent.” He knew Bobby [Cannavale] and Pete [Dinklage], but he didn’t know me, though he wrote the part for me. So I read it and I couldn’t say yes fast enough. We struggled to get it made, it was $500,000 to make. We made “Pieces of April” for something like $200,000, but it was such a beautiful part, and Peter Hedges, the director, made me a better actor. So did Tom.

These were parts that required so much of me. A lot of myself is in these parts, a lot of my own life’s struggles and traumas. But also joy. I mean, can you imagine being on a set all day with Peter Dinklage and Bobby Cannavale? It doesn’t get better than that. It was truly a labor of love, those movies. But it was glorious. 

Being a fixture in independent film in the 2000s, you crossed paths with Harvey Weinstein, whose Miramax Films released “The Station Agent.” He wanted to campaign you for award season in the supporting actress category despite you being the lead in “The Station Agent.” At the same time, United Artists head Bingham Ray was doing a supporting actress campaign for you on “Pieces of April.” Tell me about the battle with Harvey.

I hate false categories. I hate when actors put themselves in false categories. I think that’s something that needs to be addressed by the Academy. Too often it happens. When you are supporting, you should be truly a supporting player, and when you’re the lead, you have to step up and go into a harder category.

I was the lead in “Station Agent,” so I said, “No, Harvey, I’m not going into supporting, I’m going in supporting for ‘Pieces of April’ because I’m definitely supporting in that. Katie Holmes is clearly the lead of that film.” I was not going to betray Bingham. So I went up against Harvey, and he told me I’d never work again. Well, na, na, na, na, naaa. [Laughs.]

Did it get uglier than that?

Oh, yes. Threatening. It got very ugly. Some people hoped I’d switch categories but I wasn’t going to. They didn’t understand that I would be a shit to do that. It would have been dishonest and wrong. And I had the greatest moment of my career when the SAG awards came out and I was nominated for best actress in “The Station Agent” and best supporting for “Pieces.” 

You then got the Oscar nomination for “Pieces of April.” Going through all of that with Weinstein, was that motivation to take the role of New York Times editor Rebecca Corbett in “She Said”?

Oh yeah. I don’t talk about it much because of the women who were abused by him physically and deeply emotionally. This was patter to me, what I went through with Harvey. It was still difficult and terrible what he did to me, but compared to so many women who went through so much more, it was odd to talk about it. But, yes, of course, it was a motivation to do “She Said.” Of course it was. 

On spending hours inside a cave shooting Martin Scorsese’s ‘Shutter Island’ and the role she still wishes she’d gotten

I believe working with Martin Scorsese on “Shutter Island” was quite memorable, right?

[Laughs.] Oh, I shot quite some time in that cave scene. But it was a scene that you dream of as an actor working with arguably the greatest American director. It was just me and Leo [DiCaprio], that doesn’t get any better.

I remember, I was shooting the Woody Allen movie “Whatever Works” at the same time. I left Woody to go shoot with Marty. And I remember, Woody was like, “He better get you back here.” A car picked me up from the set of “Whatever Works” in New York City, where we were shooting by the UN, and drove me to Boston. And I’m in that cave, and we did so many takes, I didn’t know if I would ever see light again. [Laughs.] 

But Marty is glorious because he just lets you play. Every suggestion you have, he loves and he wants you to try it. He’s the emblem of greatness. When your heroes don’t disappoint, it’s always the greatest time of your life. 

From 2008 to 2009, there was a brief Patti Clarkson spicy era with you in romantic starring roles in “Elegy” and “Cairo Time”—

Oh, and I loved my spicy era! I mean, I often play downtrodden women, but in life I’m actually spicy. I’m New Orleans. I love my tight dresses and my high heels. And I still do. So doing those two movies, I hope those aren’t the last time doing those.

Going to Cairo, I fell in love with that city and the people. I have such beautiful memories, and it was so much fun playing a romantic leading woman. It was sexy and fun. And with “Elegy,” I started that shoot naked on top of Sir Ben Kingsley. No better way to start the day! 

Is there a role you most regret passing on, or one you still wish you’d gotten?

Early on, I lost quite a few parts. I went out to be opposite Tom Hanks in “Big.” I didn’t get cast, but I would have loved to have been in that.

You have to learn with rejection. There is always rejection in this industry. No matter how high you soar, someone is always going to try to bring you down to Earth. And sometimes down to hell, which happened to me a few times.

But you have to pull yourself back up, and I’ve had remarkable friends and family and some great men in my life who have really lifted me through some dark times in this industry. Thank god the light has been much stronger than the dark.

This interview has been condensed and edited for clarity.

“Lilly” is in theaters now.

More from this series

• David Duchovny had a very specific idea for how to make his ‘Zoolander’ cameo funny
• Patricia Arquette has a message for anyone looking for ‘Severance’ spoilers
• Carol Kane thought Gene Wilder was ‘out of his mind’ when he asked her to do a comedy with him

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